Be My Number Two

QUESTION: I want to move on, but I’m hurt. I can’t help, but to feel a sense of hope, should I?

When Randy and I met I was in a relationship . He insisted and I was not in the best relationship, so I found him pleasant and we became great friends. We continuously made numerous phone calls and through informal interactions at his place of work we began to develop feelings for each other. Some where along the line we actually became romantically involved and I was intimate with him. He was wonderful and did so many things to show me how much he loved me and constantly asked me to be with him and leave the other relationship. For so many unjustifiable reasons I could not bring myself to leave the other relationship although I was miserable in it. For a year and a half we continued to see each other and our bond was stronger and I did not get out of the other relationship. We became best friends and confidants to each other. I have worked out some issues in therapy now as to why I couldn’t move forward and leave this other person, but I so regret not leaving earlier not for Randy just because it was not good for me. In an effort to end our romantic involvement I attempted to leave so many times, and we could never really stay away from each other. I then decided to leave our friendship/relationship and made a grave error and got married to the guy who I was not having the best relationship with and left Randy the man that I truly love, I didn’t really know how much at the time. I hurt Randy so much at the time, I am so sorry and have paid my dues for the mistake I made, as my marriage only lasted 2 years, because I did it for the wrong reasons and became quickly disillusioned (about 4 months into it) with my decision and the marriage. Randy and I continued to talk throughout my marriage and when I things became clear that I had made a mistake I struggled once again to leave this man although it was clear he was not the right person for me. I dealt with guilt and what others might think as well as a great sense of failure as this was my second marriage. My first marriage lasted 15 years. Randy continued to display love and understanding for me through out this process and I then decided to separate and move towards divorce with the man I married. I decided to interact with Randy, but told him we should take it slow. He had a hard time with that, but warned me that he would not be exclusive if I was not truly committed. During this time I had an opportunity to meet his parents and his kids a couple of times. I also decided to go to grad school during this time and our time together was limited. This past December2008, he drove in a snow storm to come and see me and I remember his words “Don’t ever doubt how much I love you.” In January 2009 we became distant I had so much going on with my Grad program and I was attempting to make things perfect I wanted to start fresh by giving the news that divorce was final and I could fully commit to him. I decided to proceed with this plan in February and when I told him he was surprised and asked what changed my mind. Not the reaction I was hoping for. He then confessed he had been seeing someone else for 8 months and he was confused as to what direction he should go. I said I wanted to fight for our relationship if he wasn’t committed to her, he said he was not, but was confused. We saw each other a couple of times and he then withdrew from me and said he had to think because he felt he was being pulled in two directions and it was stressing him out. In April we met and he said he wanted to end it with me, but couldn’t bring himself to do it. Here we are in May and he finally came to a conclusion and decided to proceed with her. His reason was that she was always there very loving and caring and she did not deserve her heart being broken as he had his. He stated he was still in love with me, but he couldn’t face himself in the mirror if he hurt her as she did not deserve that. I asked if he had the same connection and friendship he had with me, he responded no. He confessed she is 28 years old, she is 14 years younger than he and she is from a culture who is very exclusive to their own and perhaps very racist as a culture as he is black and I know this is going to be difficult for them to surpass.

We’ve always been upfront and honest with each other as best friends are and I do feel he loves and is still in love with me. I don’t see how he will be able to move on when he still has feelings for me, so strong that he struggled so much to come to this conclusion. I am not that far gone to understand that I made grave errors in our relationship and that he deserves to be happy and have someone who gives him what he so deserves, but I can’t help but wonder if he will come back because I was never able to forget him even when I completely attempted to sever our bond by getting married.

His parting words were “ It was never my intention to hurt you, I love you, but this is something I need to do right now.” My sense is that he is doing this for some of the same reasons I got married. I made a commitment to marry and I had to follow through with that although I was very confused about my feelings.

I am hurt, but I intend and need to move forward. I have worked through so many of my issues that contributed to staying in a bad relationship for so long although I had someone wonderful offering me the opposite. I know I have so much to give, I wish it was him, I wanted so much to make up for all the hurt I caused by my awful decision. We constantly told each other we are soul mates. I can’t make sense of much right now, but I can’t help but think that he might come back. Please be real and tell me if I should even hold hope. Sorry for the length I thought I had to give some background.

GARLAND: To all of those who keep a candle of hope burning in their hearts, extinguish them, because they do little more than create an emotional fire hazard. (You heard it HERE first!)

Thank you for your question, but I think you need to step away from "Randy and You" and "You and Randy" and catch your breath. You are no where near over him and now you are pretending to be a mind reader and you've convinced yourself that you know how much he loves you; and you know how much he'll always love you; and you know how much he's struggling over is new young lover; and you know his true 'feelings' for you; and you know that one day he'll leave his young wife and come running back to your waiting arms. PLEASE STOP. For your own sake and sanity, PLEASE STOP.

I honestly don't know what Randy is thinking, feeling or planning and neither do you. You need to stop, for your own well being - stop trying to assume that he is dying to come running back to you. I somewhat doubt that he is, given the fact that YOU made him your number two man for years and then you married some guy that you claim you didn't love and then once you are free to love him [I suppose] he springs the new girl on you. The two of you sound like you might do each other more justice by just moving on and meeting new loves. Just because the sex might be good and the conversation might flow easily, it doesn't mean that the two of you HAVE to be together.

One other thing that leaped out to me was your comment, "she is from a culture who is very exclusive to their own and perhaps very racist as a culture as he is black and I know this is going to be difficult for them to surpass..." Do you realize just how far you are reaching with that mindset? You are laying the groundwork for the "Randy COMEBACK" that probably isn't going to happen. You are telling yourself that HER people are not going to like him and eventually he'll get tired of their 'racist' ways and they he'll leave her and come back to you. You need to accept that Randy has moved on and will probably not be coming back your way.

I don't think that you will ever be happy until you convince yourself that Mr. Randy is NOT your life or the measure of your happiness. He has moved on, you need to accept that and STOP STOP STOP checking your watch and waiting for him to come running back to you. And by the way, what I just said means to also NOT try to "just be friends" with Randy. So often Chuck and I will hear ladies talk about "just being friends..." this "My Friend" foolishness is pure horsesh*t. You and this man had a deep, intimate, odd and personal relationship that spanned years and from your letter alone I am confident that the two of you cannot be "just friends" without your heart getting involved, confused and broken. Step aside and let Randy move on pass you and then you turn your back on him and run away as fast as you can.

CHUCK: You and Randy are just like parallel lines, running on the same track forever, but never crossing each other. And frankly, that's probably how it should be. You had the chance years ago to get together with him, but you apparently lacked the emotional maturity to leave your number one at that time for your number two.

Sidebar: Why, oh, why would you ever get married to someone when the relationship was already bad? I do not get that. The rationalization is obviously, "things will get better when we get married. He/she will change." Please believe it: This never happens. I've seen people in my life treat marriage like a band-aid for a bad relationship, but all they end up doing is killing it. Anybody who does this, realize, you're just buying yourself a deferred divorce.

Randy must have deep feelings for you, if he kept up contact with you after being dumped like he was. But I'm gonna ask you to be smarter than he was with you and leave him alone. That means don't pursue this masochistic "we're just friends" fallacy. That means not looking for reasons why Randy's new relationship will not work (you hope). That means letting the thing die.

Do you have a reason to feel hopeful? Maybe. But I think the time for you two has passed. You have said that you sought therapy to help you during you marriage. Maybe you should do so again. Your and Randy's ongoing relationship is painful, narcissistic, and unhealthy. He may want it to continue, despite the fact that he wants to start something with someone new. But someone between the two of you needs to be an adult about this. Why not let it be you?

the Deal-Breaker

Hi
I just found your blog and you're both awesome men to help us women. I love reading your thoughtful and insightful answers. I hope you'll have time to help me.

QUESTION: I have been seeing a man for four years off and on when we are both in town. He was persistent and approached me a few times to ask me out but I waited several months before I finally agreed to go out with him. Neither of us wanted to get into a relationship because both of our jobs keep us traveling a lot and we are way too busy to settle down. (He works in government intelligence). We were both interested in a sexual relationship and nothing more. The sex has always been great and he is a very giving lover.
On more than one occasion he told me I was his only lover and that he was addicted to me. He also made it known that he did not want me seeing other men (although I never requested he only see me). Later, unfortunately, I started having feelings for him and I told him this. He told me couldn't help but have feelings for me but then a few months later said he that he didn't know how he felt. We continued seeing each other sexually until recently when I again told him I was in love with him.

Now he says we can no longer have sex together but that he still wants to be friends. I have reassured him I don't want a commitment but he says it's not fair for me if we continue seeing each other. Now I wish I hadn't told him how I feel because I really miss him and the sex. I've told him I don't want a commitment so what could he be worried about? (by the way, I'm in my late 40's, have already had children, and he also has grown children from his first marriage). He knows I'm independent and has always been attracted to that.

What is the problem - I've only told him I have feelings for him - I don't expect reciprocation of those feelings. So why does he want distance now? Also, another thing that has bugged me recently. I caught him in a lie and although I didn't make a big deal of it - he became very offended and denied it. Although I had proof, I let it slide because it was such a small thing. I only found it interesting that he became very upset and denied lying about such a petty thing. It seemed very important to him that I not think he was a liar.

I've felt loved by this man in action if not in words but still it is pretty strange that I have been intimate with a man for four years and still do not know him very well. I hope you can give me some objective insight. Is he serious about being just friends or was he trying to find a nice way to break up and move on? Does he really have any interest in ever seeing me again? He is very reserved - a man of very few words so it's difficult to figure him out. How do I handle this? Are there signs I should look for that would suggest I should pursue this any further or should I leave him alone? I'm heartbroken, I really miss him, and I want him back in my life.

Thank you for your help.
~S

GARLAND: Thanks for your question.

I hate to say it, but I think the "Let's be friends" is a prelude to the breakup.

What you all have had - to most men, and probably your beau in question also, is a long term friends with benefits situation... great sex, random dates, no strings, no morning after phone calls, just sex for the sake of pleasure.

Then you caught feelings. You said, you 'loved him' - oh, I'm sorry... you said you "are IN LOVE with him," which is even scarier to most guys doing the FWB thing. No matter what you say in your question to us and no matter what you say to him, when a man hears "I'm in love with you," he KNOWS that you will want a relationship VERY soon. Sure, you can say that you don't want one, you can write it down, you can tattoo it on your forehead but we will always believe and know that eventually you will want a relationship. And, it's not that you don't DESERVE a relationship... I'm not saying "relationship" like its a dirty word! It is simply... how can I put it?

It is a CARDINAL CHANGE in the terms and conditions of your FWB situation. It is a change in the scope of an agreement, a change that is equal to a breach of contract.

If this guy hasn't pushed towards a formal, monogamous relationship in four years - then he most likely isn't going to. You've dropped the "L-Bomb" on him and there's a good chance he's gone for good.

This is where men and women's differences come to the surface - you thought it was harmless to tell him you were in love, and quite frankly, those are the last words a guy in an FWB situation wants to hear. Sure, it sounds pretty shallow from a man's perspective, but this guy knows his limits and his limits are "hot sex with you once every blue moon" that's it, he doesn't want to date and he doesn't want your love, he just wants your sex. I hate to sound so blunt, but don't bank a lot on the whole "lets be friends thing" - he's ready to leave the roost.

CHUCK: S..., may I call you S? Garland's got this one pegged. I don't know for sure who devised this whole FWB concept, but I'd bet you a paycheck it was a man. Because these relationships play more to what men stereotypically want (hot sex, no strings, hot sex, little commitment, hot sex, limited cash outlay, hot sex) and less to what women stereotypically want (emotional connections, commitment, a planned future). Now I'm not saying that there are women who do not crave some of the same things men do. Not at all. But there are women like yourself, S, that enter into an FWB relationship and want more than it offers.

It's not your fault. Even despite the agreed-upon boundaries of your relationship, emotions are not something that can be regulated or controlled. But after four years of happy, uncommitted bliss, telling your friend "I love you," was effectively breaking your deal. By confessing your feelings, you made clear to him that, regardless of your assurances, you would not be content with your relationship as it's played out thus far.

All of the indications I get here suggest that you should leave him alone. He doesn't want to be in a love relationship with you. What I find unfortunate is that he is not being fully honest with you, either. That little lie you caught him in was probably just the tip of the iceberg. And he had such a strong reaction to being busted because he was feeling guilty. I can only speculate as to what he's keeping from you (another woman). And because of the casualness of your friendship, you're not even allowed to be angry about being lied to, or having information hidden from you.

I know it doesn't feel like it now, because you're without the friendship and the sex, but he did do you a favor. He could not return your feelings, and rather than string you along, he let you know it. I'm sorry things didn't work out for you. You've learned something about yourself, though. Before you consider entering into a relationship like this again, you'll probably give it more consideration, because you know that, for you, love and sex aren't that easy to separate.

Still Friends?

Hi Chuck and Garland,

First off, very informative and helpful blog. I appreciate that you both are out there and giving women the cold hard truth.

So here is my dilemma. I have a good friend and we are both attracted to each other. A few months ago we acted on this attraction- we didn't have sex- but we acted on it. A week or so afterward, he told me that he wasn't ready for a commitment and we both decided that neither one of us wanted to jeopardize our friendship. The problem is that now I realize that I do have feelings for him. I can't help or control my emotions. Seeing him only makes me realize that more and, by the looks of things he's still not ready for a serious relationship.

My question is, should I spill the beans and tell him how I feel. That way it would get everything out in the open and off my chest. I'd be able to move on if need be. But it would also put me in a vulnerable postion and give him all of the power in the relationship dynamic. The other option I am contemplating is to say nothing, but show him through my personality, character, actions etc. that I am the best woman for him and that I can fulfill his needs. This way I could save some face and keep my relationship options open.

Our friendship is still very important to me and I don't want to ruin that. So what do you think I should do? Please let me know if you can help me or if you decide to use my question for your blog. If you've a addressed a similar issue on your blog already please provide a link to your response.

Thanks in advance!

Z

GARLAND: Thanks for sharing your situation and giving us such a great compliment.

If this guy is giving you a vibe that he's not ready for a relationship - then TRUST YOUR INSTINCTS. He's NOT ready and trying to convince him otherwise is 9 times out of 10 going to leave you emotionally beaten up and drained.

Men - WE know when we're ready to make that relationship commitment, and he has done a pretty honorable thing by telling you, "Hey, I'm not ready for a commitment, lets just stay friends." A LOT of other guys would have used that opportunity to get you between the sheets. And PLEASE, PLEASE, PLEASE don't run off thinking that because he didn't want to hurt your feelings that time, that he must deep down want to care for you. He likes your friendship and thats pretty much it.

Sure, telling him that you're feelin' him would get things off of your chest - but like you said, HE would have any upper hand in the dealings the two of you have. Take my word - don't worry about telling him how you feel, or showing him how wonderful you are, or proving beyond a shadow of a doubt that you could fulfill his needs. Chill out and seek that guy that will FULFILL all of YOUR NEEDS! He told you where he stands, so take that at face value and keep looking out for YOU!

Best wishes out there!!!

CHUCK: Thank you for the question. I would say that it's probably a good idea to not profess your affection to this man, but I'm not 100% sure. In other instances, my advice is usually to communicate to the other person, and let them know how you feel. Your friend has communicated to you first, though, that he isn't ready for a relationship with you. That seems to cut off the idea of further communication on that issue. But maybe not.

I don't know if I believe in things like the "upper hand" in a relationship. If you think in those terms, how can you ever let yourself open up truly to another person. Don't get me wrong, I'm aware of a need to protect yourself from all the predators out there who will try to use you. But you have to acknowledge that there will be a time, and a person, for whom you can let your emotional guard down. It isn't Art of War all the time, ladies.

I believe that for now your best bet may be to do what you yourself suggested, and subtly let your friend know how you're feeling, while keeping your other options open. There's an attraction there, all that's missing is the willingness to act on it. If, say, after three months, he hasn't changed his mind, let it go. Some people are just meant to be friends.